Caitlin Kindred 0:23

Hello and welcome . Why did it take me a second to say I haven't finished my coffee ? I can tell you that's part of it , so I am medicated today , though .

Ariella Monti 0:35

All right .

Caitlin Kindred 0:36

Well , yeah , I took half the dose . Does that count ? Sure , no , yeah , sure , okay , well , hi everyone , we're so glad you're here . Welcome to how to Be a Grown Up . This is the how-to show for women who really thought

Introduction to ADHD and Hormones

Caitlin Kindred 0:50

they'd have it all together by now , and I blame Clueless for all of us thinking we had it together . I'm Caitlin , and with me today is Ariella Monti . She's a novelist and dictionary definition of unstoppable , and she has unicorn hair definition of unstoppable .

Ariella Monti 1:10

and she has unicorn hair . Oh thanks , but I'm that version of unstoppable that you hear on TikTok , that it's like I'm unstoppable . Yeah , that's me .

Caitlin Kindred 1:19

I like it . I like it , that'll work . So have you ever noticed that your ADHD medication just stops working out before your period , or maybe some weeks the brain fog hits you really hard , and other weeks you're just on it with everything ? Yes , enough people talk about it and I'm starting to see it more and more in creative spaces . But I want to make sure that we talk about it , because we are nothing on this show if we're not advocating for women and women's health . So this is going to be part one of our three-part series on ADHD and women's hormones .

Caitlin Kindred 2:01

We are breaking this down because there's just a lot to unpack here . Two episodes isn't enough and I want to keep it as digestible as possible . So we're going to give it to you in bite-sized pieces that your brain can actually process what's happening here , mostly because I also need to be able to break down what's actually happening here . So today we are covering the basics about what's happening in your body , why your ADHD symptoms change throughout the month and why you might have gone undiagnosed for such a long time . But before we do that , are you subscribed to this show ? Are you ? Well , you should be . Thank you , you really should Go ahead . Follow . Go ahead , subscribe whatever word your favorite podcast app uses . To make sure you don't miss episodes . We'll be right back . Hey , y'all . Pov . You find a diary exposing forbidden magic and the hot museum caretaker's life depends on you burning it , roots and Ink . The debut novel by Ariella Monti is the fantasy romance for rebels . Use promo code CK and GK to get 20% off your copy at AriellaMontecom . Again , that's all caps C-K-A-N-D-G-K for 20% off on AriellaMontecom . Get your copy for 20% off today off today .

Caitlin Kindred 3:36

All right , so this was such a hard topic . The amount of sources that I use to pull this together is very long , so I can't list all of them here . So if you want to see all of them and you want to read the articles associated , please go to the show notes or the blog post in the show notes and grab them . But I can tell you I used a couple of articles from Attitude Mag , of course , chad

The Brain Chemistry Connection

Caitlin Kindred 3:53

Ever Now Understood Health Line and a website that I hadn't heard of called Frontiers in Global Women's Health . All of these again are listed with links in the blog post for this episode . So please go check that out .

Caitlin Kindred 4:05

But here's what you need to know up front . Hormone changes are not just background noise . They are actually central to the ADHD experience for women . This is not a women are more emotional . This is about actual brain chemistry changes that impact how your ADHD medication works and how your symptoms show up and why some weeks feel absolutely impossible while others are functioning . I don't want to say good , but I want to say functioning right .

Caitlin Kindred 4:37

Yeah , okay . So let's start with your hormones . You've got a couple that are central to the experience . The primary one is estrogen . This is your brain's best friend , and you can think of this as your brain's personal assistant . Here's why Estrogen boosts dopamine activity . We have talked about dopamine a lot . Dopamine is the neurotransmitter that ADHD brains are already short on . When estrogen is high , your brain works better because estrogen boosts dopamine activity . So your focus improves your organization skills . Feel like , okay , you're pulling some things together . Maybe you put things in the correct doom pile , whatever , and life seems to make a little bit more sense . Am I wrong ? Like come on .

Caitlin Kindred 5:22

Sometimes doom piles there's doom piles for certain things . It's a doom pile , but it's at least organized by item doom pile .

Ariella Monti 5:31

Right right .

Caitlin Kindred 5:33

Here's the thing when estrogen drops which is right before your period , you know , after ovulation and during menopause good times that's when your brain's Wi-Fi signal gets weaker , right , everything still works , it's just slower , it's more glitchy , because your estrogen levels are lower , so you have lower dopamine production .

Ariella Monti 5:57

It's like dial-up .

Caitlin Kindred 5:59

Yeah , it is like dial-up . I think I actually use that a lot later .

Caitlin Kindred 6:03

The Wi-Fi signal analogy made a lot of sense to me , so be prepared to hear it more than once in this whole series . Okay , okay . So if estrogen is your brain's best friend , progesterone is its complicated friend . Progesterone rises after ovulation and , for whatever reason , it seems to counteract some of the benefits of estrogen . So it makes your impulsivity harder to manage , it makes your brain fog thicker . It's not an evil , it's not like a frenemy , it's just a it's complicated friend . When they get into your life , things kind of get mixed up . So , thank you , progesterone Jerk . All right , here's what's going on with these two hormones and I'm going to take you back to , you know , sixth grade human anatomy class and your reproduction classes , when you got to be separated from the boys and they would tell you about your hormone cycle . And we're going to use the word menstruation . Are you ready ? That word's so much , but we're going to talk about it , okay .

Caitlin Kindred 7:11

So here's your typical monthly pattern . Week one is your menstrual phase . Okay , that's when your estrogen starts out low but begins to rise and you might feel some ADHD symptom relief . Week two is your follicular phase . That's when estrogen peaks . This is the week of the month where you have the good brain and you're like , yeah , I'm on it , your medication works better , your focus is sharper and everything again just feels kind of manageable .

Understanding Your Monthly Hormone Pattern

Caitlin Kindred 7:42

Week three is your ovulation week phase . All of a sudden your estrogen drops like a rock , and that's when the brain fog kicks in and the progesterone that complicated friend starts to rise and everything starts to feel a little bit more difficult . And then in your luteal slash , pms phase , estrogen stays low and your progesterone peaks .

Caitlin Kindred 8:09

So this is why a lot of women report that their ADHD symptoms feel worse in this particular window of their cycle , because your medication seems like it's ineffective . Your focus is completely shot , your emotional regulation goes out the window . You're already like that anyway , right , because women and hormones , and it's just that time of the month for you where you're emotional . Your emotional regulation goes out the window . You're already like that anyway , right , because women and hormones , and it's just that time of the month for you where you're emotional . And then you add this extra need for additional dopamine into your brain and it just makes everything worse . So I hope that sounds familiar to you , or , if you are someone who struggles with this combination , right , adhd and cycle issues . It's brain chemistry and I feel like I did a decent job of explaining that , for this being the one subject that I got to see in high school , because I can't do chemistry to save my life .

Ariella Monti 8:58

I , you know , I , that all makes makes sense . I got it .

Caitlin Kindred 9:05

Yeah , yeah . So I call this next part the medication . What the F solved , can you tell ? I write content Okay , okay , if you're medicated , if you're one of those ones like me who takes medication and you notice that your pills just basically stop working during certain weeks , you're not imagining it and because here's why your ADHD medication I'm just going to put it out there was designed by men for men . Yeah , I made that part up , but I'm sure I'm not lying your ADHD medication Odds .

Ariella Monti 9:42

Are you're right ?

Caitlin Kindred 9:43

No , not lying no Relies on having enough estrogen around in your body to do its job effectively . Right , if estrogen boosts dopamine , then it's assuming that you have a consistent level of estrogen in your brain and body to do the job effectively . But when estrogen drops right before and during your period , it's like it's trying to stream Netflix with dialogue with terrible internet .

Caitlin Kindred 10:17

The show is still there , but everything is just so slow . It's buffering . Nothing's working properly . Yeah , your prescription has not changed , but unfortunately your brain's ability to use it has , if that makes sense . Yes , yeah , we're going to get more into medication and advocating for yourself in episode three of this series . So if you haven't subscribed and followed like I told you to at the beginning of this episode , you need to go do that now so that you don't miss the part about medication and advocacy . Just putting that out there Women get missed and we've talked about this already . It was way back in episode 154 . It's called ADHD in Women , the Late Diagnosis Epidemic , and 10 Signs you Ignored , but there are reasons that women are underdiagnosed and I'm just going to say let's all raise a collective middle finger to the patriarchy right here . Yes for doing it . You can't see us because this is an audio format , but we're doing it , thank you and thank you if you participate it .

Caitlin Kindred 11:24

Reason one is the masking problem , and if you want to deep dive into masking , go listen to episode 157 . That's adhd , masking and women , why it breaks you and six ways to embrace your authentic self again . Can you tell I write blog content

Why Your Medication Stops Working

Caitlin Kindred 11:37

for a living ? Uh , look at those titles seo for the win .

Caitlin Kindred 11:43

Yeah , okay , so here's the the too long didn't read , too long didn't listen of that episode . Women develop incredible coping strategies that hide adhd symptoms . Example color coding everything , setting 47 phone alarms , people pleasing to avoid conflict . These strategies work really well until your hormones fluctuate heavily during puberty , during pregnancy , during menopause , and then everything kind of falls apart and your ADHD symptoms become pretty obvious . So that's one reason is masking . Two is hormonal confusion . Adhd symptoms and hormonal brain fog can look identical , especially during perimenopause . Just another thing to look forward to it's fun .

Caitlin Kindred 12:35

Yeah , it's a good time I'm starting to go through it myself , and y'all women are amazing Also . It kind of sucks , anyway . The key differences here , though , are the timing ADHD symptoms have been there your whole life , even if they are masked and of look for is this ADHD symptoms or is this just ? Perimenopause is important . The other thing is the persistence of these symptoms . Adhd symptoms don't disappear completely ever , even on those good hormone days , but pure hormonal effects come and go fairly predictably with your cycle . So I mean , ariel and I can both tell you , even on our best hormonal days , it's still a hot mess up in here .

Ariella Monti 13:29

Oh yeah , yeah yeah , it's like a warm mess instead of a hot mess .

Caitlin Kindred 13:34

Right Right Some days it's even lukewarm , right Right .

Caitlin Kindred 13:37

Some days it's Right yeah . Okay , we're going to get into the big life transitions in the next episode , but that's sort of the basics here . I want to give you kind of an intro , a little bit of a preview into what we're going to talk about next , which is these massive life phases , these life cycle stages . One of them is puberty . During puberty you have those sudden hormone surges that can unmask previously undetected , hidden ADHD symptoms . So if you're a mom and your good student suddenly can't focus in middle school and high school , it might not just be teenage stuff , it might be teenage stuff and so this is often at least that I've seen , in particular with girls undiagnosed ADHD meeting those new fluctuating hormones . Another phase we have to talk about is pregnancy . Women just have it where the we have it so good wild hormone swings during pregnancy . Those affect everyone differently . Some of us cry because we take an oreo out of the package , put it on the shelf , turn around , close the pantry door and can't find our oreo .

Caitlin Kindred 14:57

I might be speaking from experience on that one , I cried , I lost my Oreo . Yeah , that was a hormone surge there . Yeah , some women feel more focused during pregnancy because of the estrogen boost right , but others feel more scattered because of the effects of progesterone . And postpartum brings a massive crash as your estrogen completely plummets .

Ariella Monti 15:24

I think I had a bigger hormone shift during postpartum than I did while I was pregnant . Oh , I did too , if I really like if I really think back on it , like , yeah , I , I truly think that that yes , yeah .

Caitlin Kindred 15:43

That was when any semblance of togetherness that I had completely fell apart was what was after oh yeah , and I was going through other life changes too .

Caitlin Kindred 15:55

Right , like I had . Obviously you just have a baby , big enough life change . And then I moved to a new state , left my job , left my friends , left

Why Women Get Missed: Diagnosis Issues

Caitlin Kindred 16:02

my family . I did a lot of things all at once that were a lot for me , that shouldn't have happened all at the same time . Um , yeah , and that all happened within eight weeks of my son being born . At the same time . All of that , in addition to the fact that my brain was just like surging with all kinds of other things , like I know , I know I probably had undiagnosed PPA . I probably probably had some undiagnosed PPD too . Like , yeah , it was , yeah , it was really bad .

Ariella Monti 16:32

Yeah , ppd was on my radar because I already I was already diagnosed with depression , so it was on my radar , but PPA wasn't . And I definitely think that I had , especially now that I know that my anxiety manifests in a way that is not like what you would think as anxiety . That is not like what you would think as anxiety , it's like more overwhelm and irritability . And yeah , looking back , on it .

Caitlin Kindred 17:09

Yes , yeah , definitely Okay . The last phase that we will get into in the next episode is menopause . Yay , in menopause , overall estrogen depletionion this is when your estrogen totally , just completely drops like a rock can cause severe brain fog and executive function problems again , issues we already know are problematic for adhd women . However , it just gets worse . During this time . Many women will experience their first or their first adhd symptoms that they can't ignore at this point in their life , and they get their adhd diagnosis in their 40s and 50s , which is completely wild and they figure it out when hormone replacement isn't enough to fix the brain fog and the other issues that they're having .

Caitlin Kindred 18:00

It's kind of wild . So I thought that it might be worth just having a couple of reflection questions , just because , again , this is such a big deal and such a big topic and it's just worth having a or when ADHD feels harder for you . Another one is does your medication seem less effective certain weeks of your cycle ? Last one is did your symptoms become more obvious during major hormonal transitions for your body ? Just some things to consider , especially if you're new in this ADHD journey . As we get into the next couple of episodes , I want to encourage you to keep those questions top of mind . So here's what's coming next . We're diving into the life stages . So puberty , especially for moms of daughters with ADHD , this is going to be a big one for you . Especially for moms of daughters with ADHD , this is going to be a big one for you . Or maybe you'll look back and go oh yeah , that was me Cool .

Caitlin Kindred 19:15

Pregnancy , perimenopause and menopause . And why I put a swear word in the notes right here because I felt like I had to . And why all of your coping strategies go to shart during each phase , phase shart . Why did I choose shart ? Why did I ? That's a gross word , um , and also hint it's . It's because all of your hormones go completely sideways , so having female hormones is an another swear word . Effing treat you know , am I ?

Caitlin Kindred 19:41

right folks , that's great um , after that episode we're going to get into medication management and advocating for yourself . So subscribe now so you don't miss that information . But one your ADHD symptoms . Again , we've talked enough , but I want to make sure it's clear to you that they're not all in your head , especially not when they're changing throughout the month . You're not crazy Like they really don't feel the same

Preview of Future Episodes

Caitlin Kindred 20:03

every week . Your brain is responding to real chemical changes , and understanding this pattern of those chemical changes is the first step to working with your body instead of against it . So all those other coping strategies we've talked about in the past will work better when you understand why certain ones of them don't work necessarily for you during the month , but then will work for you again the following week .

Caitlin Kindred 20:26

You're not imagining things . There's nothing wrong with you . There's nothing . You're not broken right . You're just a woman with ADHD and that requires you to follow your own set of rules . So that's what this conversation is here for just to let you know you're not alone in all this and we'd love to hear your experiences . Please share any reflections that you have with us . You can DM us , you can send us an email . All that information is in the show notes . Can I just really quickly . This episode is going to come out a little bit later than well . It's going to come out in a few weeks , so this is going to sound very behind the times , but I don't care . But I need to share the thing that I cannot get out of my head right now , and that is the K-pop Demon Hunters .

Ariella Monti 21:17

I assure you that by the time this episode comes out , that K-pop Demon Hunters will still be the hottest thing in the world .

Caitlin Kindred 21:25

I am hoping that's true , because I love it so much Like . For those of you who don't know , this is a movie on Netflix . It is exactly what it sounds like . The title is not hiding anything . These are K-pop stars who are demon hunters

K-pop Demon Hunters Discussion

Caitlin Kindred 21:42

, and if BTS is your , is that what it's called ?

Ariella Monti 21:48

whatever that k-pop band is I don't know , I think so . Whatever , if that's your jam .

Caitlin Kindred 21:54

This is going to be your even more . Your jam like this is the songs are good , the story is good . It's not just like a like . It's not a musical . It's not like oklahoma , where like things can be depressing and then all of a sudden people just start singing randomly . It's not les mis right right which is also like I .

Caitlin Kindred 22:13

The story is so lovely . No one's singing like . I'm reminded of the line from will and grace that blight dinner says oh , the poor people don't sing that much . Like it's just . That's why she hates musicals , which is hilarious . Um , it's not like that , right . It's like these are k-pop stars . What they do is they sing . So it doesn't they're . The singing is not out of place , but the songs are good . You guys .

Ariella Monti 22:33

The movie got a 97 on rotten tomatoes I think I heard on an episode of it's been a minute that , I think . Currently , when we are recording this , I think there are four songs from that , from that that are charting that are on like yeah , that are on the billboard like top 100 okay , now I have to look like because that's amazing .

Caitlin Kindred 23:00

um , hang on , yeah it's , it is such a fun . Oh , that Billboard's not going to get it Billboard Top 100 .

Ariella Monti 23:09

Oh my .

Caitlin Kindred 23:09

God , let's see . Oh my gosh . Yes , they have the number one song , number one , golden by Huntrix , which is the name of the K-pop . Yeah , oh my gosh , that's hysterical . Okay , wait , and they have the number four song , the number five song , the number nine song , this oh , and number 19 and 21 .

Ariella Monti 23:35

This is wild .

Caitlin Kindred 23:36

Six this is insane . You guys , if you haven't watched it , I'm going to encourage you to watch it . There's a chance your child if you have kids our age , they're probably already talking about it . Oh , and look , there's another one too . Seven , it's number 50 , but it's a different version of it . Anyway , it's kind of wild . I would check it out . It's a fun watch . I have encouraged people to watch it without their child because my son likes to sing along with it now , but their voices are so good I just want to hear them . I love when my son sings . It's my favorite thing .

Caitlin Kindred 24:08

I heard this once from one of my clients , but the client said a singing kid is a happy kid and I completely agree with that . So when my son is singing , it makes me filled with joy . Also , I want to watch this movie , so I turn on the subtitles so I can understand everything they're saying . And there's been a couple of songs where I'm like what are they ?

Caitlin Kindred 24:31

saying that's because they're speaking Korean in the middle of the song and I'm like yeah , yeah , okay , but it's a , it's a fun movie , I feel like I need . I need the girls to repair the honeymoon , because something ain't right with this world right now , so they need to they need to get the demons locked away for real . So anyway , that's my , that's my current obsession . I don't know , do you have an obsession right now ? Are you just gonna enjoy my hon moon obsession at the moment ?

Ariella Monti 24:57

no , if we're talking about music obsessions , I decided I think it was earlier this week or last week to introduce my son to Bon Jovi . And I haven't listened to Bon Jovi like regularly in a very , very , very long time , and so I kind of forgot how much I loved Bon Jovi . And I have been rocking out to these 80s power ballads , yes , like , yes , in the car . Oh my God , it's so good . You know , if your significant other is not laying you down on a bed of roses while they sleep on a bed of nails , you just need to leave them Like just leave them .

Caitlin Kindred 25:48

That's a green flag right there , did you know ? I don't think I've told you this so when I was in a sorority in college , you know there are some songs that turn up everybody , every race right , and for white people some of them are . One of them is Living on a Prayer . Don't Stop .

Ariella Monti 26:05

Believing . Don't Stop Believing , living on a prayer don't stop believing .

Caitlin Kindred 26:08

Don't stop believing , living on a prayer , several things by the eagles , stuff like that , right .

Caitlin Kindred 26:11

So , um , sweet caroline , it's one of those living on a prayer is one of them right and I told this to my father and we my dad was like so this is gonna sound weird , this is when I was still in college , so but like I , so this is going to sound weird , this is when I was still in college , so but like , I have this opportunity to go see Bon Jovi in concert . And I was like , yes , I'm going , yes , I will go with you . So I have seen Bon Jovi in concert as an adult and it was so fun .

Caitlin Kindred 26:47

I don't think my dad expected me to be as into it as I was . I was very into it . It was big fun , so I fully support this .

Ariella Monti 26:50

This is a great . This is great . Sorry , your son likes it ? Yeah , yeah , he does Like . I've been slowly like introducing him to the bands that I listen to , but it's tough when a lot of the bands you listen to have a lot of bad words .

Caitlin Kindred 27:09

Yeah , a lot of the bands you listen to have a lot of bad words in . Yeah , yeah , like when I was listening to , like limp biscuit or like you know , anything by janet jackson is probably not appropriate for my right , you know yeah like all of the 90s , like gangster rap , that , yeah , like I .

Ariella Monti 27:23

I can't play that for my child just yet , but Bon Jovi is relatively nine-year-old friendly .

Caitlin Kindred 27:33

Yes , yeah , highly recommend he's been into it . All right , I like it . Well , here's hoping that we can repair the honeymoon , and until then , we'll all just be living on a prayer . Heyo , you're welcome . Hey , okay , we're going to . This is again . This is a shorty one , so come back next week when we start talking about the life phases and how those are impacting your ADHD symptoms . Okay , as Jenny would say , make good choices . Love you mean it . Goodbye , bye .